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Become a Global Ambassador for Self-Worth. Text us your feedback!
What if seeing yourself through another lens could completely transform your self-perception? TEDx speaker and professional photographer Julie Ulstrup takes us on a journey exploring how the images we hold of ourselves shape our relationships, career paths, and sense of worth. Julie reveals how photography became her vehicle for helping people literally see themselves in new light. "Nearly 90% of everything that our brain processes in any given moment is visual," she explains, highlighting why a single photograph can trigger profound shifts in self-awareness. From cancer patients rediscovering their vitality during treatment to entrepreneurs stepping into new identities, Julie's work demonstrates the power of visual representation to change our internal narratives.
(16:37) https://www.passiton.com/
(27:32) https://www.wreathsacrossamerica.org/Newsroom/WreathsAcrossAmericaRadio
Visit Julie’s website https://www.julieulstrup.com/speaking to watch her TED Talk or visit https://www.julieulstrup.com/ to learn more about her photography.
Looking for more perspective, empowerment, and self-worth?
For a chance to hear your question answered on the air, remember to Subscribe and Leave a Voice Message at TransactingValuePodcast.com!
We'll meet you there.
An SDYT Media Production I Deviate from the Norm
All rights reserved. 2021
00:00 - Introducing Julie Allstrip: Photographer and Educator
08:52 - Photography and Emotional Intelligence Connection
17:30 - Feedback and Identity in Transitions
24:21 - Intentional Living and Intergenerational Values
34:01 - Self-Worth and Redefining Your Story
39:54 - Final Thoughts and Contact Information
WEBVTT
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The views expressed in this podcast are solely those of the podcast host and guest and do not necessarily represent those of our distribution partners, supporting business relationships or supported audience.
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Welcome to Transacting Value, where we talk about practical applications for instigating self-worth when dealing with each other and even within ourselves, where we foster a podcast listening experience that lets you hear the power of a value system for managing burnout, establishing boundaries, fostering community and finding identity.
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My name is Josh Porthouse, I'm your host and we are redefining sovereignty of character.
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This is why values still hold value.
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This is Transacting Value.
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Nearly 90% of everything that our brain processes in any given moment is visual, and so to be able to see a photograph, a physical representation of what you look like and how you show up in the world, is really powerful.
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Today on Transacting Value.
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How you view yourself can directly impact and even dictate how other people see you as well, and today we're talking with TEDx speaker and professional photographer, Julie Allstrip.
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All about what that means and how to capture somebody in just the right light so that they continue to view themselves in a way they want other people to see themselves as well.
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Now, without further ado, I'm Josh Porthouse, I'm your host and from SDYT Media, this is Transacting Value, Julie, how are you doing?
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I'm great.
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How are you, Josh?
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I'm doing very well.
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I appreciate the opportunity to come on and talk and get your perspective.
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I think you're maybe the second photographer we've ever had on the show, definitely the first with an entire career in education first.
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Yeah, so I guess my first question, just to sort of set the stage here what does this look like for you?
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Let's just build some resonance here.
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Where are you from?
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What sort of things have shaped your perspective in all of these transitions and what's the why?
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Well, I live in Colorado right now.
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I was born in LA, so I've had a life where I've moved around a bit, and transformation has always been really exciting for me, changing things up in my own life and my personal life and my professional life.
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I worked as an educator for 25 years in higher education, in high school and middle school, and loved it until I didn't anymore and it was time for me to do something different and I wanted to create something that would create impact, influence and, of course, income.
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And I was able to do that as a photographer pretty quickly and pretty lucratively so lucratively, that's maybe not a word, and that doesn't often happen with photographers.
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With photographers, it's often a race to the bottom in the entrepreneurial world because people are doing it for free.
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Can I get a cheap this, can I get a Anyway?
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So I created this campaign to really help people change the way they see themselves and, in turn, change the way they see the world and change the way the world sees them.
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Obviously this is intentional, this is deliberate, the way you're posing people, the advice you're giving them, obviously, the insight I think your photos are also going to give them.
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But what about the nerves, the courage, the I don't know appetite, the drive, the ambition?
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I'm assuming for some people there's some anxiety too.
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Oh yeah, and any woman probably over the age of 35 being and some men too, but really are terrified to have a photograph taken, terrified to create something that is, I always feel like Mr Papa Giorgio no, not Papa Giorgio, the guy in my big fat Greek wedding, george Portakalis, who always is, you know, it comes from the Greek word Well, portrait comes from the French word portray, and people can be afraid of what we put out in the world and being seen in a much bigger way.
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So that has been my road to really helping people change the way they see themselves and seeing what they have to offer.
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I think people can be afraid, but is that always a problem?
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Do you think Like to the point where maybe it actually requires change, or is it just something do you think we can learn to accept?
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Is what a problem?
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What's the question?
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Those sort of nerves, that sort of anxiety, that sort of worry about how we come across in the world, that maybe even that degree of awareness is it necessary?
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I think that there are ways to overcome being seen.
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As you know, sometimes people play small and they think I'm too old, I'm too young, I'm too fat, I'm too thin, my eyes aren't right, my hair's not right.
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What if I don't choose the right clothes?
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Am I going to look this way or another?
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There's that fear of judgment and fear of really showing who we are in the world.
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Well, we don't know.
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I mean, you mentioned transition earlier, 25 years in education to then say, well, maybe I'm not the educator in the same style I was before, maybe I'm not the educator in the same style I was before.
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Yeah, Still some sort of identity shift, absolutely, absolutely.
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And I've had clients, entrepreneur or whatever it is a financial planner.
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If they're just starting a career, maybe they haven't seen themselves that way before.
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Sure, what do you think it is about the photos that gives people that sense of recognition, gives people that sense of recognition.
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So in the way that I photograph people, I start and I create space for them.
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So I worked as a school counselor for 20 years, so creating space is something that comes naturally to me, and I ask them a series of questions about who they are.
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What would your friends you know, what are words your friends would say about you?
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What about colleagues?
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And really getting to the core of who that person is is really getting to the core of who they are in the world, much less their role in their business or their family, and when I've done family portraits, which I've also done, it's the same thing.
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You know, what does your family enjoy together?
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How would you describe yourself?
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So really creating a space where people are comfortable being who they are in front of the camera?
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Because that you're right, it can be terrifying.
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Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
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Are you familiar with this?
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Well, I assume maybe you are.
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But this continuum of emotional intelligence, oh yeah, right, how you either want to come across or how you come across in your own head.
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To then, how do you come across when it's out of your head, essentially, and how do people receive it right, and then how you manage and control those things as well, I suppose.
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So, when you're talking that degree of emotional intelligence for somebody, what kind of an impact have you found transitions to have or hold when they involve identity?
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So I do a lot of volunteer work and I photograph women who are going through breast cancer treatment.
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As one example, and I had a woman tell me that after she wasn't feeling well because of the side effects from chemotherapy and she's a very self-aware woman, she's actually a therapist herself she said she felt like she was dying because of this treatment.
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The treatment was so hard and she started to choke up when she started to tell this story and she said when I saw these photographs of me looking very much alive, I knew that everything was going to be okay and that I could do this Like.
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She saw that spark in herself.
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And you know, when you talk about social, emotional learning, a lot of times as adults, as people out in the world entrepreneurs, business people we don't have that opportunity to get reflected back to us who we really are, unless it's a formal review or something like that.
00:09:39.923 --> 00:10:09.659
So having that really personal experience of so having that really personal experience of having yourself reflected back to you and you can actually see it nearly 90% of everything that our brain processes in any given moment is visual, and so to be able to see a photograph, a physical representation of what you look like and how you show up in the world, is really powerful.
00:10:10.419 --> 00:10:12.682
Alrighty folks sit tight and we'll be right back on Transacting Value.
00:10:12.682 --> 00:10:18.570
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Porthouse Tampa Bay Realtor, where values start in the home.
00:10:59.645 --> 00:11:09.201
And to be able to see a photograph, a physical representation of what you look like and how you show up in the world, is really powerful.
00:11:10.384 --> 00:11:12.288
Absolutely, absolutely.
00:11:12.288 --> 00:11:16.818
And the feedback point you just mentioned, I guess it is really hard to come by.
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I mean professional development, maybe not, like you said, your annual reviews, or, like, in my case, for anybody new to the show and Julie you included most of my career has been in the Marine Corps infantry, and so what that looks like compared to, I don't know, an education system as a teacher or a photographer or any other outlet, has its differences.
00:11:39.005 --> 00:11:51.801
But one mechanism, one metric where it's very similar is there's not a lot of personal development feedback you're getting at least not with a degree of seriousness, unless you're just giving somebody a hard time or something.
00:11:51.801 --> 00:11:53.990
But the professional feedback's there.
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Yeah, run faster, your score's not high enough, do more pull-ups All sorts of measurable things for performance, but not really internally.
00:12:03.115 --> 00:12:29.072
And I think when you try to pull in or well, in the DOD, department of Defense case, when you actually pull in the majority of your entry-level staff, let's call it, or employee base human capital, at 17 to 22 or 17 to 24 years old, I think that kind of personal feedback can be pivotal 10 years later, 20 years later, when they get out of the DOD.
00:12:30.134 --> 00:12:30.736
Absolutely.
00:12:31.966 --> 00:12:34.592
What do you think works to overcome that?
00:12:34.592 --> 00:12:48.471
Because that deficiency, like you just said, is pretty common Coming out of a workplace or transitioning from one identity, when it's associated directly to your professional role, into a new identity, when your role changes.
00:12:48.471 --> 00:12:51.398
How do you bridge the gap, how do you address that?
00:12:52.466 --> 00:12:56.533
like you said, it's that awareness, it's that um.
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And, by the way, my, my son, served as an infantryman in the army, as a ranger, so thank you for your service, especially today.
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Absolutely and thank him for his.
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As we celebrate the day of this recording.
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I think, like you said, it takes a real awareness.
00:13:17.969 --> 00:13:37.587
That I always really appreciated about working as a counselor is being able to give people those tools so when they went out into the world they could reflect back to themselves and say who am I being today?
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What is my purpose?
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How am I going forward?
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What does that look like for me?
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How is that creating impact and influence in the world?
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Go ahead, I was just going to say those are big topics and so when everything seems like, when there's more potential energy in the universe than actually kinetic that you're controlling, there's so many possibilities, what is my purpose really gets outshined more often than not by how do I pay the electric bill.
00:14:12.427 --> 00:14:15.168
So I think oftentimes all of those considerations can get pushed aside.
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Like you said, the CEOs, the entrepreneurs, the work-life imbalance type high-functioning people it tends to be more the afterthought than the forethought.
00:14:26.116 --> 00:14:33.142
So what role do you find photography having in that regard, as a reminder or as an inspiration?
00:14:40.825 --> 00:14:41.385
Or how do you qualify that?
00:14:41.385 --> 00:14:41.907
Yeah, I think it's both.
00:14:41.907 --> 00:14:43.971
I think it's a reminder of who we are in this moment, in this present moment.
00:14:43.971 --> 00:14:51.716
It's a reflection of everything that's brought us to where we are, and it can also be a projection of who we want to become.
00:14:54.605 --> 00:15:04.315
So does that mean we all go find I mean professional bias here aside but does that mean we all go find professional photographers on our work, anniversaries, just to catalog?
00:15:04.315 --> 00:15:05.982
Or how do we complement?
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that.
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Well, that's one way to do it.
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I think working with a coach as well is a great way to make sure that your values are aligned your values, my values our values are aligned in what we're doing and how we move forward.
00:15:25.485 --> 00:15:26.447
You know, to your point.
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You know paying the electric bill and doing all of the things that we need to do in our day-to-day and really connecting with the value of why am I here in the world?
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What is the work that I'm here to do?
00:15:43.095 --> 00:16:20.106
You know, I would say this 25 year career that I've had as an educator, this career that I've had as an entrepreneur, a photographer and a coaching consultant I actually coach and consult other businesses really comes down to my basic core values of helping people to become the next best version of themselves, whether that's in a photograph where they can see the next best version of themselves, you know, like I said, literally through a different lens, or in their, their day-to-day habits.
00:16:20.106 --> 00:16:28.975
You know, you know this from being in the military there are certain things you got to do and if you don't do those things, you're not going to pay the bill.
00:16:30.038 --> 00:16:30.558
Absolutely.
00:16:32.666 --> 00:16:35.172
All right, folks sit tight, We'll be right back on Transacting Value.
00:16:37.586 --> 00:16:41.613
You've heard it said he's a diamond in the rough, or maybe diamonds are forever.
00:16:41.613 --> 00:16:50.119
Here's something else I've learned about diamonds they're just pieces of coal put under pressure for a long, long, long time.
00:16:50.119 --> 00:16:55.076
So when I start feeling like I want to give up, I think about that little piece of coal.
00:16:55.076 --> 00:17:01.326
And if that piece of coal can make something of itself by not giving up, so can I.
00:17:01.326 --> 00:17:03.793
Persistence is in you.
00:17:03.793 --> 00:17:07.809
From PassItOncom.
00:17:07.809 --> 00:17:13.833
There are certain things you got to do, and if you don't do those things, you're not going to pay the bill.
00:17:14.934 --> 00:17:23.377
Absolutely, absolutely, and even still, though it becomes a sort of indoctrinated way of thinking and viewing the world.
00:17:23.377 --> 00:17:25.885
Because that's all perspectives, I suppose.
00:17:25.885 --> 00:17:30.046
Right, it's just, you absorb it from the culture you're most accustomed to in the moment.
00:17:30.046 --> 00:17:33.375
And so what about when that changes?
00:17:33.375 --> 00:17:40.896
You know you, you move to a different city, state, a new school, uh, where you spent time in Spain, for example.
00:17:40.896 --> 00:17:42.843
I think I heard you say, right, well, you spent time in Spain, for example.
00:17:42.863 --> 00:17:44.066
I think I heard you say right, I did.
00:17:44.066 --> 00:17:48.115
I had a six-month sabbatical in Spain.
00:17:49.217 --> 00:17:49.657
That was cool.
00:17:51.489 --> 00:18:06.300
It was really cool and I feel like everything that we do, when we do it purposefully again, whether we're looking forward or reflecting back, you know what is?
00:18:06.300 --> 00:18:09.670
What did I bring to that experience?
00:18:09.670 --> 00:18:19.679
Or when I go in with intentional purpose, what is it that I want to bring into this next, you know, chapter of my life?
00:18:21.207 --> 00:18:21.769
How do you know?
00:18:21.769 --> 00:18:30.938
I mean, how do you know what's appropriate, let alone maybe specifically what to bring or who that's going to help create you into in the future?
00:18:30.938 --> 00:18:33.068
I mean, how do you prioritize any of that?
00:18:33.931 --> 00:18:47.699
You know there's a lot of talk about authenticity, right, but there's also really feeling into and knowing into who you are, who we are individually.
00:18:49.441 --> 00:18:51.026
Okay, and how are?
00:18:51.046 --> 00:18:54.272
you going to bring your gifts to any given situation?
00:18:56.196 --> 00:19:00.315
Well, sure, that's two different things, I suppose, but probably equal importance.
00:19:00.315 --> 00:19:02.972
Yeah, what you bring, and then what's the situation?
00:19:02.972 --> 00:19:04.146
Yeah, absolutely.
00:19:04.146 --> 00:19:09.410
Well, the awareness, like we mentioned earlier, yes, and so this is actually a good point.
00:19:09.410 --> 00:19:10.993
I think this is a good point of the show.
00:19:10.993 --> 00:19:13.887
It's called developing character, d-d-d.
00:19:13.887 --> 00:19:26.787
Developing character, and Julie, you included as well.
00:19:26.787 --> 00:19:40.846
Again is it's two questions and my working theory from, I guess you could say, an informally exposed social psychology perspective here, growing up most of my adult life in the Marine Corps infantry.
00:19:40.846 --> 00:20:02.397
It is limited when it's applied to, well, regular society outside the military, but it's interesting because then, deploying all over the world, the only exposure I got was firsthand, and so it wasn't necessarily through a classroom and it wasn't necessarily through a Zoom screen.
00:20:02.397 --> 00:20:13.494
It was on foot in villages with a rifle, trying to figure out who to talk to, how to talk to, and and in a lot of those places, obviously the americans are here, we're in uniform, right?
00:20:13.736 --> 00:20:16.969
yeah but they don't like us, they didn't want us there.
00:20:16.969 --> 00:20:19.134
Yeah, is he just going to make it worse?
00:20:19.134 --> 00:20:22.392
You're drawing attention or whatever reasons we don't want to talk to you.
00:20:22.392 --> 00:20:34.724
But the more we spoke, the more we realized we do have things in common, like we're both just trying to protect our families and we both have jobs and we're both, you know, filling this sense of service or duty or whatever applied.
00:20:34.724 --> 00:20:46.067
And so my theory is that values are a shortcut to identity, but also relationship and communication and, all things considered, culture in any environment.
00:20:46.067 --> 00:20:48.953
And so my two questions yeah, thank you.
00:20:48.953 --> 00:21:02.511
So my two questions for you, as well as vulnerable as you want to be, but my first is rooted as you were growing up, just for the sake of a baseline what were some of the values you were exposed to or that you maybe were raised on?
00:21:04.016 --> 00:21:05.921
Yeah and I'm happy to share.
00:21:05.921 --> 00:21:19.688
So I was born in LA and my family moved to Chicago when I was five and family was always still is very important to my parents.
00:21:19.688 --> 00:21:25.278
My dad is still alive, we have family in Norway and we had family in California.
00:21:25.278 --> 00:21:39.807
And people say to me they're like, oh, that must have been hard and now I'm a grandparent myself and I felt really close to my grandparents and I think it was that very intentional choice that my parents made.
00:21:39.807 --> 00:21:51.013
We moved because my dad had a job transfer and then my parents made, you know, we moved because my dad had a job transfer and then, you know, my parents fell in love with the Chicago area, you know.
00:21:51.013 --> 00:21:55.587
So my dad still lives there, but family was always really important.
00:21:55.768 --> 00:22:07.800
So part of what I grew up exposed to was the huge gift of visiting family in California, visiting family in Norway.
00:22:07.800 --> 00:22:11.477
That wasn't like a thing that people did when I was growing up.
00:22:11.477 --> 00:22:17.409
People weren't, you know, like hopping over to Europe, like people hop over to Europe, so.
00:22:17.409 --> 00:23:01.266
So part of that for me also became this sense of adventure and this sense of, you know, really finding out, like getting to know my cousins, and I was able to hear my dad speaking Norwegian with my grandmother and finding like just really that, listening, you know, listening for understanding body language, you know, and those weren't things I don't think that were ever said to me, but I became very aware of you know people and how we interact with each other and what that looks like and what that means, and and understanding so and again.
00:23:01.365 --> 00:23:04.847
So that led to my career as a counselor.
00:23:04.847 --> 00:23:09.471
My mom was an educator, you know, working in higher ed.
00:23:09.471 --> 00:23:25.342
So you know, kind of it all builds on each other and I think if each of us look at our history for better or for worse, like maybe we're like, oh no, I'm not going to be like that because of the way we grew up.
00:23:25.342 --> 00:23:34.026
Or oh yes, I am going to be like that because I, I appreciate that and I love that about my culture and my heritage.
00:23:34.346 --> 00:23:46.532
Whether it's just your own experience or not, you know well, that's a benefit to the awareness you were describing earlier and and then obviously, historically, throughout your lineage, whatever legacy they then provided.
00:23:46.532 --> 00:23:50.509
I think it helps because it gives you options, not because it gives you a life sentence.
00:23:51.712 --> 00:23:52.576
A hundred percent.
00:23:53.265 --> 00:24:06.195
Yeah, and I think I guess, now that I'm saying it out loud, you could also translate that to then whatever professional experience you've had up to that point where it doesn't mean that that's who you were or all you were, it's just who you were then.
00:24:06.195 --> 00:24:11.249
And what can you take to move forward then in the future?
00:24:11.249 --> 00:24:12.491
Super powerful.
00:24:12.491 --> 00:24:14.257
So my second question then is so what?
00:24:14.257 --> 00:24:16.069
What are some of your values now?
00:24:16.069 --> 00:24:17.334
How has that shifted and changed?
00:24:19.165 --> 00:24:22.852
Well, interestingly, my values now are.
00:24:22.852 --> 00:24:26.798
One of my biggest values is courageous action.
00:24:26.798 --> 00:24:42.933
There's a deep awareness for me of courageous coming from the heart, you know, knowing what is in my heart, and I'm a person who I know enough about myself to know that.
00:24:42.933 --> 00:24:46.660
You know I need to sleep on something overnight.
00:24:46.660 --> 00:25:02.507
I'm not going to be a person who's going to make a decision right away, but if something really feels like it's the right thing to do, even though it's scary, I'm probably going to do it and I can't give like a you know metrics.
00:25:02.507 --> 00:25:34.126
If this, then this you walking into a town with a rifle in a you know US serviceman's uniform is different than me walking on the Camino de Santiago.
00:25:34.126 --> 00:25:42.048
I had an experience where I heard a woman, so I had been there five months and my Spanish was fluent.
00:25:42.048 --> 00:25:47.308
There were people that thought that I was a European at that point, which made me really happy.
00:25:47.730 --> 00:25:48.952
Yeah, congratulations.
00:25:49.654 --> 00:25:58.673
Thank you, yeah, and I heard a woman in very, you know, english kind of Spanish Donde esta una restaurante?
00:25:58.673 --> 00:26:01.547
You know this woman asking, and I went up to her and I asked her.
00:26:01.547 --> 00:26:03.269
I said can I help you?
00:26:03.269 --> 00:26:08.134
And she said, oh, I'm looking for a restaurant and I don't speak Spanish very well.
00:26:08.134 --> 00:26:25.099
She was trying, though, right, she was 70 years old, she was also on a sabbatical, she was a nun from Western Pennsylvania, and so you know that interaction, you know it just made her day a little bit easier finding a restaurant.
00:26:27.307 --> 00:26:28.151
Yeah, it's interesting.
00:26:28.151 --> 00:26:32.268
Like we talked about earlier, humanity tends to recognize humanity.
00:26:32.268 --> 00:26:36.298
I think it's the humility in that process that dictates the outcome.
00:26:36.298 --> 00:26:40.953
Yeah, and it really can be a powerful shift.
00:26:40.953 --> 00:26:43.839
But you talk a lot about this, right?
00:26:43.839 --> 00:26:46.185
You actually have a TED Talk online as well.
00:26:47.027 --> 00:26:47.909
I do yeah.
00:26:48.990 --> 00:26:50.773
How to transform the way you see yourself.
00:26:51.516 --> 00:26:51.695
Yes.
00:26:52.396 --> 00:26:53.499
Is this a short process?
00:26:53.499 --> 00:26:54.508
How do we do it?
00:26:54.508 --> 00:26:55.411
What does that mean?
00:26:55.411 --> 00:26:56.093
What does it look like?
00:26:56.093 --> 00:26:56.615
What are your thoughts?
00:26:57.605 --> 00:26:59.789
Well, I had the one example.
00:26:59.789 --> 00:27:05.420
I've had other women, I mean, I've had high school seniors to see photographs of them.
00:27:05.420 --> 00:27:21.816
So, yes, it can happen that quickly Now, whether or not it sticks, you know, there are people who literally, they see the photographs that we've created and they cry, they cry because, they've never seen themselves that way.
00:27:27.894 --> 00:27:29.461
Yeah, pride, because they've never seen themselves that way.
00:27:29.461 --> 00:27:31.686
Um, but yeah, alrighty, folks sit tight and we'll be right back on.
00:27:32.107 --> 00:27:33.108
Transacting Value.
00:27:33.108 --> 00:27:39.378
Alrighty folks, if you're looking for more perspective and more podcasts, you can check out Transacting Value Wreaths Across America Radio.
00:27:39.378 --> 00:27:44.568
Listen in on iHeartRadio.
00:27:46.092 --> 00:27:57.759
You know, there are people who, literally, they see the photographs that we've created and they cry, they cry because, they've never seen themselves that way yeah.
00:28:01.711 --> 00:28:05.942
So then that's when, for example, photos exist.
00:28:05.942 --> 00:28:07.692
But then what about?
00:28:07.692 --> 00:28:10.817
Well, as a guidance counselor, for example, working at the school?
00:28:10.817 --> 00:28:13.641
I'm assuming you said higher education.
00:28:13.641 --> 00:28:14.362
So what is that?
00:28:14.362 --> 00:28:16.545
17, 18 years old to early 20s.
00:28:17.450 --> 00:28:21.334
Yes, actually I worked at the university level.
00:28:21.334 --> 00:28:26.440
I worked also with grad students and there was even some adult education in there.
00:28:26.440 --> 00:28:27.961
I was in program development.
00:28:27.961 --> 00:28:32.027
So but yeah, 24, you know 28.
00:28:32.971 --> 00:28:39.333
Yeah, so you saw all different phases of identity crises and social pressure, and question and judgment.
00:28:39.333 --> 00:28:59.395
So then, for example, the earlier groups in terms of age, the younger groups, right of students, professors, maybe the kids where their parents were professors they're all going through the same things, but from a hundred different backgrounds for a hundred different students.
00:28:59.395 --> 00:29:08.522
So is there a through line, is there a commonality that you could look at and say this is generally how you can work through some of these things.
00:29:08.522 --> 00:29:09.894
What advice do you have?
00:29:19.009 --> 00:29:20.172
Well, I think it's so individual.
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